| Pages in topic: < [1 2] | Professional indemnity insurance Thread poster: Willemina Hagenauw
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Mats Wiman 
Sweden
Local time: 00:39
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
+ ...
In memoriam | We ought define our roles - I'm trying hard | Feb 11, 2003 |
The object of my hard drive is to try to convince more colleagues (than the ones I have registered so far) to realise the role of the translator.
His/her job is to convert a text at a maximum level of linguistic exactitude, so that a native speaker kan interpret the content correctly. The translator can only do this as best s/he can.
S/he cannot take any responsibility for what happens with the text after delivery.
That is up to the buyer(s).
... See more The object of my hard drive is to try to convince more colleagues (than the ones I have registered so far) to realise the role of the translator.
His/her job is to convert a text at a maximum level of linguistic exactitude, so that a native speaker kan interpret the content correctly. The translator can only do this as best s/he can.
S/he cannot take any responsibility for what happens with the text after delivery.
That is up to the buyer(s).
The agency and their client must define their mutual responsibilities - not including the translator. This often seems NOT to be the case. A lot of vague assumptions are floating around - a less developped and virgin market.
Nothing stops the translator to take on additional responsibilities, but if they are not specified, the translator must remain just a translator.
The agency/client must take responsibility for his/her choice of translator which some of them do not seem to realise. If they did, they would be much more conscientious when they make their choice.
Following the logic of my possible oppenents (stupid agencies in most cases) the agencey just has to throw out the job to ANY translator (with the right price) and then leave him/her with total responsibility for the effects the translation MIGHT have.
Example:
\"Translator shall indemnify X and hold it harmless against all liability or loss, and against all claims or actions based upon or arising out of damage or injury to persons or property caused by the performance of the contract or by conditions created thereby. Specifically, Translator shall indemnify and hold X harmless in any suit initiated against X as a result of an inaccurate or unacceptable translation, and shall be liable for all costs, including, reasonable attorneys fees, expended by X in defense of such suit.\"
Is this what we want? Surely not.
To rot it out we have to be very clear as to our roles.
I am working on a general disclaimer meant to nail down our definition of our own role.
Would you not support such a measure?
BR
Mats
[ This Message was edited by:on2003-02-11 18:55] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Ralf Lemster
Germany
Local time: 00:39
English to German
+ ...
| Two problems | Feb 11, 2003 |
Hi Mats,
I appreciate your efforts, but there are two areas where I see a problem:
1. Please don\'t state that \"translators do not need professional indemnity cover\" without clearly stating that this only holds true if (and only if) you have a clear, mutually accepted understanding (preferably in writing) as to what your responsibilities are. (Your earlier postings regarding insurance cover did not specify this - which I think they were somewhat risqué.)
<... See more Hi Mats,
I appreciate your efforts, but there are two areas where I see a problem:
1. Please don\'t state that \"translators do not need professional indemnity cover\" without clearly stating that this only holds true if (and only if) you have a clear, mutually accepted understanding (preferably in writing) as to what your responsibilities are. (Your earlier postings regarding insurance cover did not specify this - which I think they were somewhat risqué.)
2. Setting out a very narrow definition of a translator\'s role and responsibilities isn\'t exactly going to help generate more lucrative business. I believe the way forward for translators is to link up in regionally diverse networks where a team is able to provide a far better service than a single-handed translator. To \"drive this concept home\" with direct clients, you need to incorporate project management, quality assurance etc.
Where I wholeheartedly agree is that you can\'t mix the two concepts - the notion of agencies cashing in on the mark-up whilst pushing all the risk to a \"pure\" translator is unacceptable. (Which, of course, doesn\'t stop some from trying... beware.)
Best, Ralf ▲ Collapse
| | | | mmachado (X)
English to Portuguese
| But if we really want to get insured... | Feb 11, 2003 |
Hello All,
Thanks to you all for your comments, but if someone really wants to get insured, is there anybody that could provide info on an insurance company (some where in EU) that could provide this (to people also some where in the EU).
I would like to know more about PI, but it seems difficult to get some company providing it...
If you have any info on this matter, please advise.
Best regards,
Món... See more Hello All,
Thanks to you all for your comments, but if someone really wants to get insured, is there anybody that could provide info on an insurance company (some where in EU) that could provide this (to people also some where in the EU).
I would like to know more about PI, but it seems difficult to get some company providing it...
If you have any info on this matter, please advise.
Best regards,
Mónica Machado ▲ Collapse
| | | | | Thanks for all your views! I have read them with interest. | Feb 11, 2003 |
First of all, the company I have been insured with is called Markel and is based in the UK - I was in sured by them through a UK broker - I hope this is helpful for you Monica.
I sometimes also do certified translations and signing a document to this effect means for me that I am liable for an incorrect translation. I don\'t understand Mats comment that a translator only translates and therefore is not liable. In my view we - like any other professional - render a service ... See more First of all, the company I have been insured with is called Markel and is based in the UK - I was in sured by them through a UK broker - I hope this is helpful for you Monica.
I sometimes also do certified translations and signing a document to this effect means for me that I am liable for an incorrect translation. I don\'t understand Mats comment that a translator only translates and therefore is not liable. In my view we - like any other professional - render a service or sell a product on the basis of our skills and expertise, so there must be some guarantee for the purchaser of these services and products that they are buying expertise and are able to rely on this, and personally I feel a responsibility in this respect.
I tend to agree with Paul and have been taking out an insurance, mostly merely for my own peace of mind and, after this discussion, will continue to do so!
Many thanks again for everyone\'s views! ▲ Collapse
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Mats Wiman
Sweden
Local time: 00:39
Member (2000)
German to Swedish
+ ...
In memoriam | A freelance translator is a freelance translator | Feb 12, 2003 |
Dear Ralf and all,
To sum myself up:
I am talking about freelance translators that:
1. Are not making a certified translation.
2. That have not assumed any other responsibility than that of translating the text - as best s/he can.
Problems arise from tha fact that some believe that a freelance translator has the responsiblities of a certified translator making a certified translation or a translator with ADDITIONAL, AGREED r... See more Dear Ralf and all,
To sum myself up:
I am talking about freelance translators that:
1. Are not making a certified translation.
2. That have not assumed any other responsibility than that of translating the text - as best s/he can.
Problems arise from tha fact that some believe that a freelance translator has the responsiblities of a certified translator making a certified translation or a translator with ADDITIONAL, AGREED responsibilities.
I do also try to take as much responsibility as I can but if it has not been agreed I am only accountable with part or the whole of my fee.
Indemnity is so much more!
BR
Mats ▲ Collapse
| | | | | When is a translator not a translator? | Feb 12, 2003 |
Translators provide a service. Whether one likes it or not, apart from any contractual liability, there remains the problem of liability under tort, negligence under common law systems. Similar provisions are codified in statue in certain jurisdictions. I\'m trying to take a practical angle on this. Whether or not a translator should be liable is not being questioned here. I\'m just imagining the scenario where a client decides you are liable and that you are the wone who receives the writ of su... See more Translators provide a service. Whether one likes it or not, apart from any contractual liability, there remains the problem of liability under tort, negligence under common law systems. Similar provisions are codified in statue in certain jurisdictions. I\'m trying to take a practical angle on this. Whether or not a translator should be liable is not being questioned here. I\'m just imagining the scenario where a client decides you are liable and that you are the wone who receives the writ of summons zand statement of claim in your post box one morning!
Whether we like it or not, if a client decides to take legal action against a translator, alleging that the work handed in was erroneous and that client seeks to be compensated for that loss, I would prefer to have professional indemnity insurance the day that client decides to pursue. Insurance might not change the degree of liability, but it might enable you to pay for legal advice, which, as speaking as someone who worked in the field of professional indmnity indemnity, could cost you a packet! Further, it might even help you defend yourself sufficiently well for the claimant to realise that he has no justifiable claim against you. That\'s aplug for legal advice. And the day you need it, its nice to know you can pay for it.
Moreover, if a court does hold the translator liable, in manyt jurisdictions, if you are exercising as a freelance, thus liberal profession, with no limit on your liability ( i.e., you are not a limited company), then the whole of your estate (everything you own) could be at stake in freeing up funds to compensate the claimant. OK That is a true horror story scenario, but theoretically possible. If that were ever to happen, then it would be better to have some cover to indmenify you.
I\'m not going to get ridiculous about it. Insurance companies don\'t have the ready-made professional indemnity policy to hand for translators. Insurers try to estimate the risk and then to cover that risk at a cost which is globally profitable for them. (They usually manage!). I did the round of the major insurance companies here and they were basically unable to put a figure on the level of risk.
The only reasonable way to get apopropriate cover, I have found, is to go through a professional association and see if what they offer suits you.
Note. In spite of being an advocate of professional indemnity cover, I can\'t help seeing Mat\'s point though. The client does have a degree of responsibility for the translation. Translations are generally only for assistance purposes only and not to be relied upn etc. We see that sort of disclaimer quite often. On the other hand, from the client\'s point of view, he is paying you to provide a service so that the target reader will understand the contents of the original. Not easy to reconcile the two : I\'m paying you to do a job but you say you\'re not responsible for anything which might go wrong as a result of a mistake on your part. Not sure a court would see it that way. Although, it might be difficult to prove. We really can go round in cifcles on this one. Each individual has to see this the way it suits him!
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| | | | Ralf Lemster
Germany
Local time: 00:39
English to German
+ ...
| Potential liability is the key to my concerns | Feb 12, 2003 |
Quote:
Moreover, if a court does hold the translator liable, in manyt jurisdictions, if you are exercising as a freelance, thus liberal profession, with no limit on your liability ( i.e., you are not a limited company), then the whole of your estate (everything you own) could be at stake in freeing up funds to compensate the claimant.
Which is exactly why I set up my business in the legal form of a private limite... See more Quote:
Moreover, if a court does hold the translator liable, in manyt jurisdictions, if you are exercising as a freelance, thus liberal profession, with no limit on your liability ( i.e., you are not a limited company), then the whole of your estate (everything you own) could be at stake in freeing up funds to compensate the claimant.
Which is exactly why I set up my business in the legal form of a private limited company... ▲ Collapse
| | | | Paul Stevens
Local time: 23:39
Member (2003)
Spanish to English
+ ...
| Agree with Nikki | Feb 12, 2003 |
I would just like to register my full agreement with Nikki\'s comments of this morning. Whilst I can agree with many of the points that Mats has made, at the end of the day there is lawys a chance that someone somwhere might hold you liable for an error in a translation that you have done.
Nothing on this thread, or elsewhere for that matter, has so far convinced me that taking out PI insurance is not a wise precaution, even though I consider that the chance of having a cla... See more I would just like to register my full agreement with Nikki\'s comments of this morning. Whilst I can agree with many of the points that Mats has made, at the end of the day there is lawys a chance that someone somwhere might hold you liable for an error in a translation that you have done.
Nothing on this thread, or elsewhere for that matter, has so far convinced me that taking out PI insurance is not a wise precaution, even though I consider that the chance of having a claim under such a policy is a very remote possibility if you are a good professional translator. At the end of the day, however, I would rather have peace of mind than risk the entire future of my family. As far as I\'m concerned, NOT taking out PI insurance is NOT a viable option. ▲ Collapse
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