| Pages in topic: < [1 2 3 4 5] > | Are any other translators having a quiet period workwise? Thread poster: Rose Webb
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Jeff Whittaker 
United States
Local time: 10:10
Spanish to English
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| Here's one of my favorite books | Oct 28, 2023 |
Future Hype: The Myths of Technology Change
Link to Book: https://amzn.to/3seebIX
" Everyone knows that today’s rate of technological change is unprecedented. With technological breakthroughs from the Internet to cell phones to digital music and pictures, everyone knows that the social impact of technology has never been as profound.
But everyone is wrong. In fact, the pace of... See more Future Hype: The Myths of Technology Change
Link to Book: https://amzn.to/3seebIX
" Everyone knows that today’s rate of technological change is unprecedented. With technological breakthroughs from the Internet to cell phones to digital music and pictures, everyone knows that the social impact of technology has never been as profound.
But everyone is wrong. In fact, the pace of change isn’t notably faster than in times past and most “revolutionary” technologies are just refinements of past breakthroughs. Using dozens of entertaining examples, high-tech industry veteran Bob Seidensticker debunks nine technology myths, proving that:
The rate of change is not exponential (myth #1),
Important new products don’t arrive any faster than they ever have (myth #3),
The Internet doesn’t really change everything (myth #8), and much more.
Future Hype exposes the hidden costs of technology and will help both consumers and businesses take a shrewder position when the next 'essential' innovation is trotted out. " ▲ Collapse
| | | | Lingua 5B
Bosnia and Herzegovina
Local time: 16:10
Member (2009)
English to Croatian
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| Is there a book | Oct 28, 2023 |
Is there a book about how businesses use technology as an excuse to drag the rates down?
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:10
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| From one of the reviews on Goodreads | Oct 28, 2023 |
The reviewer (Armands Skutelis) writes
This book was written in 2006. Some of you might remember a young little startup called Youtube that was launched less than a year before this book was published, and another promising new startup called Facebook. Nokia ruled the mobile phone scene, these phones had started to become really smart and GPS, along with Google Maps, had only began to shift from military tech to consumer tech. And Wikipedia in the eyes of "grownups" was something akin to urban dictionary. We lived in a world where everything "online and for free" was synonymous to utter trash. So no wonder that Mr. Seidensticker proudly proclaimed that internet consists mostly of garbage.
[Edited at 2023-10-28 19:25 GMT]
| | | | | Twas ever thus | Oct 29, 2023 |
Baran Keki wrote:
What if a PM favours a certain translator.... [etc.]
That has always happened, AFAIK.
On the assumption I'm more of a person B than person A (I don't hover waiting for jobs and I don't accept work 2 nanoseconds after seeing that a project is on offer - I at least look at the stuff first!), I think the only factors that would explain what I'm seeing are:
a) an upsurge in A-type translators (not impossible, granted)
b) a switch by more agencies to this type of working.
Anyway, as I said, I asked the agencies I work with about the reduction in projects, and 4 of the 5 I asked said that they simply were not getting the projects arriving in my areas. This is borne out by the project numbers, which are incrementing more slowly (where such systems are used).
I recall a while back, remarking on Twitter (I think) to the effect I was getting cheesed off with every document I translated harping on about how the company embraced innovation. Fact is, although I was cynical about such claims at the time, at least some of them must be dabbling with AI in various areas, including getting their corporate bumpf translated into English. It is the hot topic in innovation, after all. And indeed I know of colleagues - I stress, in the same pair & working fields as me - who have been informed by direct clients that that is exactly what is happening.
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Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:10
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| Not only that | Oct 29, 2023 |
Charlie Bavington wrote:
I recall a while back, remarking on Twitter (I think) to the effect I was getting cheesed off with every document I translated harping on about how the company embraced innovation.
And the other thing every document harps on about is how the company is dedicated cutting costs and increasing efficiency. Not surprising that some are switching to AI/MT.
Dan
| | | | Baran Keki
Türkiye
Local time: 17:10
Member
English to Turkish
| Russian translators | Oct 29, 2023 |
I wonder how the Russian translators are faring in the European translation market these days. I seem to recall them saying that they saw a marked decrease in jobs when the invasion started. Is there still some sort of boycott going on against their language pairs?
| | | | Baran Keki
Türkiye
Local time: 17:10
Member
English to Turkish
| Big companies | Oct 29, 2023 |
Dan Lucas wrote:
And the other thing every document harps on about is how the company is dedicated cutting costs and increasing efficiency. Not surprising that some are switching to AI/MT.
Haven't a good portion of those multinationals, big on innovation and cost efficiency, traditionally been taking care of their translation requirements in-house rather than going to translation agencies?
I suppose they were 'harping on' about the same bollocks when the CAT tools first came about 15-20 years ago, which served (and continues to serve) to hurt translators in the form of "CAT tool discounts".
| | | | | Special military operation, not "invasion"! | Oct 30, 2023 |
Baran Keki wrote:
I wonder how the Russian translators are faring in the European translation market these days. I seem to recall them saying that they saw a marked decrease in jobs when the invasion started. Is there still some sort of boycott going on against their language pairs?
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[Editado a las 2023-10-30 01:15 GMT]
| | | | Dan Lucas
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:10
Member (2014)
Japanese to English
| Not necessarily a bad thing | Oct 30, 2023 |
Baran Keki wrote:
Haven't a good portion of those multinationals, big on innovation and cost efficiency, traditionally been taking care of their translation requirements in-house rather than going to translation agencies?
I don't know. Like most people in this industry, I can only feel the part of the elephant in front of me, and can only guess what the beast looks like in its entirety. Some of my end clients are very large companies, and one would imagine that they would have one or two in-house translators to provide quick turnaround or translation of confidential material.
Having said that, in areas where there is a steady flow of translation projects (manuals?) it may make sense to keep the work in-house. For large and complex projects such as financial filings, which only occur once every three months at most, it may make economic sense to outsource to specialist agencies. Clearly that does happen rather a lot, at least in my language pair.
I suppose they were 'harping on' about the same bollocks
I don't regard cost-cutting as something that is intrinsically bad - in fact, it is inarguably a significant positive for the economy as a whole. For example, if cellphone manufacturers had not cut costs throughout the supply chain, a smartphone would probably still cost something like $10,000 a unit, whereas these days you can get a decent device for less than 2% of that amount.
If suppliers of PCBs, LCDs, multilayer ceramic capacitors and other parts had refused to try to cut costs, they would not have seen the growth in revenue and profits that they have in fact experienced. And we would not be benefiting from smartphones.
Obviously, those in love with translation for its own sake will argue that the profession should be above all this demeaning chit-chat about price cutting and I agree that not much fun when you are the person on the sharp end. Nevertheless, lower prices are what drive growth in demand, and to achieve that you need to become more efficient so that you can (if required) reduce costs. So I'm pretty phlegmatic about it.
I think the translation industry would not have grown to the size it is without CAT tools to enable lower costs, I believe that non-abusive use of CAT tools is justifiable and reasonable, and I am certain that use of CAT tools and in of itself does not prevent one from making a decent living. I am aware that many disagree, some vehemently.
Regards,
Dan
| | | | Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:10
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| Cutting costs | Oct 30, 2023 |
Dan Lucas wrote:
I don't regard cost-cutting as something that is intrinsically bad
I'm sure we all cut our costs wherever we can. I know I do. So I understand when others do it to me.
But if the quality of my output, or my ability to deliver it, is likely to be affected. then NO.
| | | | | Client education | Oct 30, 2023 |
Basing translation prices exclusively on a word rate seems more and more unsustainable.
Translating the meaning of a non-specialised text can be done very well by a good MT engine today, albeit with some hiccups: Translation app prompts terror alert in Lisbon.
But if there is a specialised vocabulary, it still needs to be researched. AI can help ... See more Basing translation prices exclusively on a word rate seems more and more unsustainable.
Translating the meaning of a non-specialised text can be done very well by a good MT engine today, albeit with some hiccups: Translation app prompts terror alert in Lisbon.
But if there is a specialised vocabulary, it still needs to be researched. AI can help a bit, but we can't trust AI without double-checking, as the protagonist in the above story found out. So if the client wants MT reductions, then would they please supply a glossary we can trust without researching it or accept that we use whatever suggestion the MT engine of their choice gives us.
And if it's for marketing, then a simple translation is not sufficient. It needs copywriting on top. That's extra.
And if the marketing or other content needs to be adapted to the local market, then it's localisation. That's extra too.
The trouble is that some clients expect a BMW with all the options for the base price of a Fiat. That's unsustainable for BMW suppliers. In our industry too, we need to explain why we cannot supply that for the price of a Fiat instead of just giving in and undermining the entire profession. But sure, if they have a simple text that simply requires a good MT revision, then I don't see any problem in giving them a lower rate. At the end of the day, it's my hourly payment that matters. ▲ Collapse
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Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 15:10
Member (2008)
Italian to English
| A very good point | Oct 30, 2023 |
Thomas T. Frost wrote:
Basing translation prices exclusively on a word rate seems more and more unsustainable.
That is an excellent point.
It would be desirable to arrive a better classification based on word count as the baseline + another factor takes account of complexity in an objective manner.
And that really *IS* where AI could help us.
Here's a link to a fascinating paper on some of the algorithms educators use to assess text complexity: "Determining Text Complexity"
https://www.isbe.net/Documents/5-determining-text-complexity.pdf
[Edited at 2023-10-30 10:36 GMT]
| | | | Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 16:10
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
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Baran Keki wrote:
I suppose they were 'harping on' about the same bollocks when the CAT tools first came about 15-20 years ago, which served (and continues to serve) to hurt translators in the form of "CAT tool discounts".
It's this kind of prejudice (see also MT) that keeps translators stuck instead of moving forward. I learnt to work with a CAT tool in the late nineties, as a student. As a translator I've only known translation without a CAT tool for 1 or 2 years (2000 and 2001). To me it's mind-blowing that there are still translators that are refusing to use it. The benefits are there and they are significant. CAT discounts are generally justified, by the way. But of course you will always have bottom-feeders who try to lower them to an inmpossible level. I wouldn't know, I stay far away from such potential clients.
Even the argument that you can't deliver a fluently sounding translation with a CAT tool (segmentation, you know) is nonsense. A few weeks ago I was asked to translate a few blog articles for a holiday park company about their winter offerings with the express demand to make it sound very natural and fluent. I rarely get feedback, but this time I did : I received a message that they were impressed by the translation result. So there you go.
| | | | Lieven Malaise
Belgium
Local time: 16:10
Member (2020)
French to Dutch
+ ...
Tom in London wrote:
It would be desirable to arrive a better classification based on word count as the baseline + another factor takes account of complexity in an objective manner.
And that really *IS* where AI could help us.
That would be the so-called AI based 'dynamic pricing'. Could be interesting if it would really be neutral, but how, as a translator, are you supposed to know that a price increase or decrease (because this goes both ways) proposal is justified ? Do you just have to take your client's word for it ? Do you just have to accept this, because AI said so ?
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