| Teemakohased leheküljed: < [1 2 3 4 5 6 7] > | First ProZ.com translation contest Vestluse postitaja: María Florencia Vita
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| "Contest winner" vs. "best translator" | Jan 25, 2007 |
Andrea Riffo wrote:
Hello everyone!
- On the matter of this site becoming more "unprofessional" due to this idea, I think that it may happen if Proz decided to feature a "Translation Contest Winner" on the frontpage. Enrique has already stated that it won't happen.
Hi Andrea, I am afraid my previous answer may have been too concise. What I said was we will not announce the winner of any branch of the contest as "Voted Best XXX to XXX Translator". On the other hand a "Translation contest winner" on the front page sounds good to me.
Enrique wrote:
lexical wrote:
...but I think it will not be able to resist featuring the 'winning' translator as "Voted Best Lithuanian to German Translator" (for example).
No, we will not do that.
Regards,
Enrique
| | | | | Members-only voting | Jan 25, 2007 |
Ruxi wrote:
2. Why should non-members vote if they are not allowed to participate?
If it has to be a blocade for them, than be it, but a total one.
Hi Ruxi,
You are right on this point but this is how the contest has been planned, voting will also be for members only.
Regards,
Enrique
| | | | Kirill Semenov 
Ukraina
Local time: 04:50
Liige (2004)
inglise - vene
+ ...
Ruxi wrote:
1. The resons for not accepting non-members to participate are not strong enough.
The contest could be organized by us all and not by the staff, so the staff would not need to work for us.
2. Why should non-members vote if they are not allowed to participate?
If it has to be a blocade for them, than be it, but a total one.
And if we sit down and think correctly, the paying members do not pay for more rights, but to support the site, because they can and have the money.
And they have a lot of other rights already, which non paying members do not have.
And non-paying members support the site a lot with their contributions, ideas, subjects, KudoZ aso.
Strange enough: there are people who want to take part and are not allowed and some others who are allowed and do not want to take part. How many would be the rest?
Anyway I am out. Who cares about suggestions, ideas,aso.?
Ruxi, just pay for the membership, it will save your time and money better than your complaining about the "non-paying" members discrimination at the site. For me, this site is much more than generous for non-paying users.
[Edited at 2007-01-25 23:14]
| | | | Cristina Popescu (X)
Rumeenia
Local time: 04:50
inglise - rumeenia
+ ...
| Hat's off to Nicole | Jan 25, 2007 |
I think we should try to keep things balanced. Nicole is absolutely right and to my mind we should all try to have an attitude that is a bit more supportive. I'm sure the ProZ.com staff are only doing their best.
Sarah Johnson wrote:
just because you're a member doesn't make you superior or better than non-members. you already get A LOT of benefits that we don't
As for Sarah's comment, I think it is completely out of place. It's true that, as you say, we get a LOT of benefits that non-paying users don't have, but isn't that the whole idea? I really don't understand this attitude in some non-members. Why exactly is it that you feel excluded and mistreated?
I'm really disappointed in the tone of this thread. I'm totally supportive of the contest idea and will be participating and I'm especially glad there is no prize.
All my best to everyone.
Cristina.
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Vito Smolej
Saksamaa
Local time: 03:50
Liige (2004)
inglise - sloveeni
+ ...
SITE LOCALIZER | I am looking forward to a resounding thump.... | Jan 25, 2007 |
Thanks for supporting the site.
EXactly the reason for my feedback.
smo
| | | | | Isn't it just like one great Kudoz point? | Jan 25, 2007 |
Proz staff make it possible for us to enjoy this site. I feel they do it not for money reasons only - they put their hearts and souls into it. Actually, that is why so many people are members and "guests" here. They have invented lots of wonderful features: BB, Kudoz etc. Now they are about to try out another idea. I believe they have every right to do it the way THEY think is best. There may be zilions of constructive ideas and suggestions - it is just impossible to have them all implemented. I... See more Proz staff make it possible for us to enjoy this site. I feel they do it not for money reasons only - they put their hearts and souls into it. Actually, that is why so many people are members and "guests" here. They have invented lots of wonderful features: BB, Kudoz etc. Now they are about to try out another idea. I believe they have every right to do it the way THEY think is best. There may be zilions of constructive ideas and suggestions - it is just impossible to have them all implemented. I wonder what makes all the people who find the idea "disgusting", "appaling" etc have such stong feelings. It is just a kind of one great Kudoz point - and there are Kudoz leaders displayed everywhere including the front page.
As for members - non-members issue ... Ladies and gentlemen, there are lots of opportunities on the Net to participate in FREE translation contests. What's the big deal? Please correct me if I am wrong - is it said anywhere Proz is a charity? Running a site with an ever increasing number of users must be quite expensive. Still lots of features are accessible for non-paying users. You may call me naive but when I was one (just a couple of months ago), the generosity of the site owners was a very pleasant surprise to me. I believe lots of non-paying members are as grateful as I was then. ▲ Collapse
| | | | lexical
Hispaania
Local time: 03:50
portugali - inglise
| Let's be positive | Jan 25, 2007 |
I didn't intend to contribute further to this thread, especially after Enrique gave us an assurance that Proz wouldn't blazon the winner's name on the front page of the site, but it seems he is already backtracking with his latest comment.
It's clear that a lot of people would find such a contest fun, in a lighthearted way, and their views and wishes deserve to be respected. At the same time, many others (me included) are concerned about the effect on the professionalism of Proz's i... See more I didn't intend to contribute further to this thread, especially after Enrique gave us an assurance that Proz wouldn't blazon the winner's name on the front page of the site, but it seems he is already backtracking with his latest comment.
It's clear that a lot of people would find such a contest fun, in a lighthearted way, and their views and wishes deserve to be respected. At the same time, many others (me included) are concerned about the effect on the professionalism of Proz's image (the Proz.Idol argument) and about the potential divisiveness and arguments that might ensue (just think about the bad atmosphere that has emerged in some Kudoz pairs).
I think Proz staff have to find a way to balance these views/enthusiasms/reservations, rather than (dare I say?) just steamrollering ahead. Such a balance might lie in keeping it a fun, low key activity which those who want to can participate in, without splashing the results on the front page, with the attendant risk of misleading visitors about their validity and detracting from the professionalism of our community.
I would actually support the idea as a purely fun activity - no prizes, no icons, no spurious 'recognition'. It could even be organised a bit like the Quick Polls - let Prozians propose short texts for translation.
I'm hoping that Proz staff will display the maturity of judgement to recognise that there are valid - and strongly held - views on both sides, and to tailor their initial ideas to accommodate as many people as possible. Let's see. ▲ Collapse
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lexical wrote:
I didn't intend to contribute further to this thread, especially after Enrique gave us an assurance that Proz wouldn't blazon the winner's name on the front page of the site, but it seems he is already backtracking with his latest comment.
I did not say such thing, and if I was not clear enough I apologise and clarify here: I made no general comment on the way the winners will be announced and by no means am I limiting such announcements. All I said was that we will not announce the winner of any branch of the contest as "Voted Best XXX to XXX Translator".
In other words, we will not equate "contest-winner" with "best- translator". That is all my post meant to say.
Regards,
Enrique
Enrique wrote:
lexical wrote:
...but I think it will not be able to resist featuring the 'winning' translator as "Voted Best Lithuanian to German Translator" (for example).
No, we will not do that.
Regards,
Enrique
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Andrea Riffo
Tšiili
Local time: 23:50
inglise - hispaania
+ ...
| I stand corrected | Jan 25, 2007 |
Enrique wrote:
Hi Andrea, I am afraid my previous answer may have been too concise. What I said was we will not announce the winner of any branch of the contest as "Voted Best XXX to XXX Translator". On the other hand a "Translation contest winner" on the front page sounds good to me.
You're right, they're two different things (my bad)... I am not sure I like the second option either, though.
In case my first intervention came off as negative or pessimistic, please know it was not intended to be. Quite the opposite, my intention was to deal with some of the louder arguments against and make a couple of suggestions.
Valery, you're right, so far it also seems to me like one big KudoZ point, which is something I am not too fond of, considering the amount of bickering that section creates (its great usefulness notwithstanding because I think it is one of the site's best features).
It is because of this, and the arguments that Lexical and others have given (Proz.com Idol) that I suggested that a Top 3 best-liked translations for each pair rather than one winner only might be a good alternative... do not forget, we work with words and our words are what potential clients look for, and there's a world of difference between "winner" (never mind "best translation/translator") and "most-voted" or "best liked". In our field, nuances are essential.
And honestly, can anyone tell in an unequivocal manner what makes for a "best" literary translation?
[Edited at 2007-01-25 22:10]
| | | | transparx
Ameerika Ühendriigid
Local time: 21:50
inglise - itaalia
+ ...
| I don't like competitions, and I don't like prizes, but... | Jan 25, 2007 |
I really don’t understand why so many people are against what appears to be an innocuous activity. If anything, this will prove –once and for all– that if you give the same text to, say, ten different translators, you will get ten different, possibly excellent, results. In addition, for those who decide to participate (I still don’t know whether I’m going to have the time), it will be a chance to learn something, I’m sure. There is always something to learn by looking at other people... See more I really don’t understand why so many people are against what appears to be an innocuous activity. If anything, this will prove –once and for all– that if you give the same text to, say, ten different translators, you will get ten different, possibly excellent, results. In addition, for those who decide to participate (I still don’t know whether I’m going to have the time), it will be a chance to learn something, I’m sure. There is always something to learn by looking at other people's work!
As for the so-often-debated member/non-member dichotomy, my understanding from reading past threads is that several users choose to remain “non” not because they can’t afford to pay, but because they disagree with the site’s policy and rules. Now, while it is certainly everyone’s right to join or not to join, I fail to see how not paying the required (modest) membership fee can help such people resolve their inner conflicts.
[Edited at 2007-01-25 22:57] ▲ Collapse
| | | | Malik Beytek (X)
Local time: 05:50
| Don't make it a translation contest; instead, make it a writing contest. | Jan 25, 2007 |
I have a hunch that a writing contest would have a number of significant advantages over a translation contest. I might enumerate them if I can think up of concrete statements of reasons in favor of a writing contest. It is just a hunch right now.
I have only glanced through the first two or three pages of the thread and if I'm repeating an idea already suggested, please forgive.
| | | | Malik Beytek (X)
Local time: 05:50
| Writing, you see, is not translation, but it is a skill relevant to translation. | Jan 25, 2007 |
So, for one thing, it would be a less sensitive matter to announce, on a translators' web site, a winner of a writing contest than a winner of a translation contest. (And, down the road, you could perhaps organize contests testing other relevant skills perhaps, like... uhm, well I don't know, vocabulary, maybe...)
Second, that way, you won't have to exclude any native speakers of any languages (because you would probably announce a theme, or maybe themes, again written in English, b... See more So, for one thing, it would be a less sensitive matter to announce, on a translators' web site, a winner of a writing contest than a winner of a translation contest. (And, down the road, you could perhaps organize contests testing other relevant skills perhaps, like... uhm, well I don't know, vocabulary, maybe...)
Second, that way, you won't have to exclude any native speakers of any languages (because you would probably announce a theme, or maybe themes, again written in English, but not more than two or three sentences each, and invite contest entries of so many hundred words each, in any language, including English).
That's it, I guess.
[Edited at 2007-01-25 23:26] ▲ Collapse
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| Why not wait and see what happens when the contest is run? | Jan 25, 2007 |
Clearly half the community is for the contest and the other half against. My proposal is to let the contest run, observe how everything proceeds, and then discuss it again afterwards, if necessary. Things might work out differently than some people expect, and it is only by testing the waters that we will find out what the advantages and disadvantages of such a contest are, as well as what refinements are needed if the idea is to be developed further.
Astrid
| | | | | Literary contests are great! | Jan 25, 2007 |
Malik Yenigelen wrote:
I have a hunch that a writing contest would have a number of significant advantages over a translation contest. I might enumerate them if I can think up of concrete statements of reasons in favor of a writing contest. It is just a hunch right now.
Thanks Malik!
Literary contests are great!
We had some six of them in the Spanish forum and they were very successful and a lot of fun (and some very good material came out of them). The Romanian forum had also good experiences and I am sure many other communities did it as well.
We also tried to do literary contests in the (English language) Literature and Poetry forum and for some reason the participation was low.
We do not rule out doing literary contests in the future, but in this case we wanted to test the waters with a translation one.
Kind regards,
Enrique
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