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Invoicing after BREXIT
Thread poster: Gabriele Beckmann
Gabriele Beckmann
Gabriele Beckmann  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 10:42
Member (2007)
French to German
+ ...
Jan 12, 2021

Hello,

I am living in France and work with some translation agencies in the United Kingdom.
Does anybody know how invoices have to be established from now on?
Are the VAT numbers still valid? Do I have to put the VAT on the invoice now?

Thank you for your help.


 
Christopher Schröder
Christopher Schröder
United Kingdom
Member (2011)
Swedish to English
+ ...
No change Jan 12, 2021

Invoice as before.

No, you shouldn't add VAT.

Yes, VAT numbers here are unchanged.


 
Dr. Matthias Schauen
Dr. Matthias Schauen  Identity Verified
Germany
Local time: 10:42
Member (2007)
English to German
Treat like any other non-EU country Jan 12, 2021

The reliable German VAT Guide provided by Triacom (available via https://www.triacom.com/forms/vat.form.de.php), for instance, says:

Für Leistungen der Dolmetscher und Übersetzer (»sonstige Leistungen«) gelten ab dem 1. Januar 2021 nach dem so genannten Bestimmungslandprinzip Großbritannien und Nordirland einheitlich als Drittlandgebiet und sind wie beispielsweise Kana
... See more
The reliable German VAT Guide provided by Triacom (available via https://www.triacom.com/forms/vat.form.de.php), for instance, says:

Für Leistungen der Dolmetscher und Übersetzer (»sonstige Leistungen«) gelten ab dem 1. Januar 2021 nach dem so genannten Bestimmungslandprinzip Großbritannien und Nordirland einheitlich als Drittlandgebiet und sind wie beispielsweise Kanada oder die Ukraine zu behandeln.

So no VAT, but also no reference to reverse charge on the invoice. And since there is no reverse charge procedure any more, the client's VAT ID should also not be needed.

[Edited at 2021-01-12 10:45 GMT]

[Edited at 2021-01-12 10:46 GMT]
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Thomas T. Frost
Christopher Schröder
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:42
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Do it in French Jan 12, 2021

Gabriele Beckmann wrote:

Hello,

I am living in France and work with some translation agencies in the United Kingdom.
Does anybody know how invoices have to be established from now on?
Are the VAT numbers still valid? Do I have to put the VAT on the invoice now?

Thank you for your help.


Since you are (presumably) resident only in France (for tax purposes) you should only comply with French regulations. Your invoices should, of course, be in French. Ignore what might or might not apply in other countries with different regimes - because they do not apply to you. You should only ever comply with French tax regulations. Any attempt to ALSO comply with regulations of other countries would be illegal (and you would probably get it wrong anyway).



[Edited at 2021-01-12 11:00 GMT]


Axelle H.
 
Thomas T. Frost
Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 09:42
Danish to English
+ ...
Not as before Jan 12, 2021

Chris S wrote:

Invoice as before.

No, you shouldn't add VAT.

Yes, VAT numbers here are unchanged.



Well, not as before, as the UK is no longer in the VAT area, so there is no reverse VAT procedure for the UK any more, as Matthias said.


Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Angie Garbarino
 
Christopher Schröder
Christopher Schröder
United Kingdom
Member (2011)
Swedish to English
+ ...
??? Jan 12, 2021

Thomas T. Frost wrote:
Well, not as before, as the UK is no longer in the VAT area, so there is no reverse VAT procedure for the UK any more, as Matthias said.

That doesn't affect the invoices you send in any way. You still don't charge VAT. Or am I missing something here?


Tom in London wrote:
Your invoices should, of course, be in French.

Tom, do you know that to be the case? (UK invoices don't have to be in English)


 
Thomas T. Frost
Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 09:42
Danish to English
+ ...
Reverse VAT Jan 12, 2021

Chris S wrote:

Thomas T. Frost wrote:
Well, not as before, as the UK is no longer in the VAT area, so there is no reverse VAT procedure for the UK any more, as Matthias said.

That doesn't affect the invoices you send in any way. You still don't charge VAT. Or am I missing something here?



Yes, it does affect the invoices and you are missing something, Chris.

A VAT-registered translator in the EU has to validate the VAT number of the client in another EU Member State and document that on the invoice, since the client is responsible for reporting the VAT.

As the UK is no longer a part of the EU's VAT area, this reverse VAT procedure is no longer relevant in case of billing clients in the UK from the EU.


Angie Garbarino
 
Axelle H.
Axelle H.  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 10:42
English to French
We still don't know .. Jan 12, 2021


Tom in London wrote:
Your invoices should, of course, be in French.

Tom, do you know that to be the case? (UK invoices don't have to be in English)


[/quote]
Unfortunately yes, because our taxmen don't speak English and our invoice must be in French ...

I was talking to my (french) accountant this morning, no official information regarding VAT between France and UK .. so wait and see ;(


Tom in London
 
Christopher Schröder
Christopher Schröder
United Kingdom
Member (2011)
Swedish to English
+ ...
Cross-purposes Jan 12, 2021

Thomas T. Frost wrote:
As the UK is no longer a part of the EU's VAT area, this reverse VAT procedure is no longer relevant in case of billing clients in the UK from the EU.

Ah, OK, I’m with you now. No, you no longer have to put the client’s VAT number on the invoice.

I understood the question as being about whether a translator should now charge VAT. And there is no change there.


 
Gabriele Beckmann
Gabriele Beckmann  Identity Verified
France
Local time: 10:42
Member (2007)
French to German
+ ...
TOPIC STARTER
To all Jan 12, 2021

Thank you for your comments so far.

My question concerned all aspects of the invoice, not only whether or not I have to charge TVA.

To summarize what I have learned so far:
As before, I don't charge TVA.
New: I don't have to put the client's VAT number

What about the sentence "The recipient has to account for VAT"?

Meanwhile I got an answer from the customs. They told me that I have to make a last European Declaration of Services (
... See more
Thank you for your comments so far.

My question concerned all aspects of the invoice, not only whether or not I have to charge TVA.

To summarize what I have learned so far:
As before, I don't charge TVA.
New: I don't have to put the client's VAT number

What about the sentence "The recipient has to account for VAT"?

Meanwhile I got an answer from the customs. They told me that I have to make a last European Declaration of Services (I don't know whether this is the correct name in English) in January. ("..., vous effectuerez vos dernières DES, au plus tard le 10 du mois suivant soit le 10/01/2021 ensuite vous n'aurez plus de formalités pour vos opérations vers ce pays")
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Thomas T. Frost
Thomas T. Frost  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 09:42
Danish to English
+ ...
VAT Jan 12, 2021

Gabriele Beckmann wrote:

What about the sentence "The recipient has to account for VAT"?



That's only relevant in case of reverse VAT so no longer necessary for services provided to the UK after 31/12/2020.

Gabriele Beckmann wrote:

Meanwhile I got an answer from the customs. They told me that I have to make a last European Declaration of Services (I don't know whether this is the correct name in English) in January. ("..., vous effectuerez vos dernières DES, au plus tard le 10 du mois suivant soit le 10/01/2021 ensuite vous n'aurez plus de formalités pour vos opérations vers ce pays")



Yes, we have to declare reverse-VAT billing to the UK for services provided until and including 31/12/2020. And invoices established in 2021 for services provided before the end of the transition period still have to conform to reverse-VAT rules.


Angie Garbarino
 
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida  Identity Verified
Portugal
Local time: 09:42
Member (2007)
English to Portuguese
+ ...
Invoices in a foreign language Jan 13, 2021

Tom in London wrote:

Gabriele Beckmann wrote:

Hello,

I am living in France and work with some translation agencies in the United Kingdom.
Does anybody know how invoices have to be established from now on?
Are the VAT numbers still valid? Do I have to put the VAT on the invoice now?

Thank you for your help.


Since you are (presumably) resident only in France (for tax purposes) you should only comply with French regulations. Your invoices should, of course, be in French. Ignore what might or might not apply in other countries with different regimes - because they do not apply to you. You should only ever comply with French tax regulations. Any attempt to ALSO comply with regulations of other countries would be illegal (and you would probably get it wrong anyway).



[Edited at 2021-01-12 11:00 GMT]


The rules for invoicing in foreign languages vary from country to country. I issue all my invoices in English or French according to the client’s country (I have no Portuguese clients); what the Portuguese tax authorities don’t accept is invoicing in another currency.


 
Angie Garbarino
Angie Garbarino  Identity Verified
Local time: 10:42
Member (2003)
French to Italian
+ ...
Invoices in English and invoicing after Brexit Jan 13, 2021

Both accountants (the former Italian and the current Spaniard) told me that it is ok to invoice always in English, being it a lingua franca accepted all over the world, so I do like that since 1999.
Regarding invoices after Brexit I was told that it is like invoicing in the USA.
Just sharing info I got.


Christopher Schröder
Maria Teresa Borges de Almeida
 
Sheila Wilson
Sheila Wilson  Identity Verified
Spain
Local time: 09:42
Member (2007)
English
+ ...
Hedge your bets Jan 13, 2021

Angie Garbarino wrote:
Both accountants (the former Italian and the current Spaniard) told me that it is ok to invoice always in English, being it a lingua franca accepted all over the world

My Spanish accountant advised me not to produce invoices that aren't in Spanish. He said that it wouldn't matter until the day I was audited. Then I might have to pay to have them all translated by a sworn translator. I was selected a while back for a very scary minor audit.

I designed a trilingual invoice, in Spanish, English and French (my language of communication with some clients). All main legends ("invoice date", "delivery date", etc) and column headings ("quantity", "unit", "tariff", etc) are in all three languages, and the dates themselves are in ISO format (YYYY-MM-DD). Within the main body of the invoice my accountant insisted on the heading "Translation into English:-" (or its French equivalent) being translated, but he was happy for all the individual job references on my monthly invoices to be in just one language.

As I've now retired I'd be happy to post an example of a redacted invoice here, if anyone's interested.


 
Tom in London
Tom in London
United Kingdom
Local time: 09:42
Member (2008)
Italian to English
Always in English Jan 13, 2021

Since I am resident in the UK for tax purposes, all my invoices are in English, no matter where they go.

If/when the UK tax authorities want to check my accounts I assume they expect them all to be in English. After all, that's why we keep accounts in the first place, isn't it?


 
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Invoicing after BREXIT







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